How did his family move from Hungary to America, and what inspired him to become a Catholic priest, a Franciscan friar, and later an Anglican minister? An interview with Frank Hegedűs, the lead pastor of the St. Margaret of Scotland Anglican Episcopal Church in Hungary, celebrating the 50th anniversary of his ordination. The occasion for the conversation is the ongoing Week of Prayer for Christian Unity, which was initiated 117 years ago by an American Episcopal/Anglican minister. Written by Szilárd Szőnyi.

 

– Your surname suggests that your father might have been a Hungarian.

– My father was indeed born in a tiny village, Kány, in northeastern Hungary in 1911. When he was two years old, the family relocated to Michigan in the United States.

– Did you hear Hungarian at home?

– My childhood memories are of my father speaking Hungarian with his mother. My mother was of Polish background, so I heard both languages, but nobody taught the children Hungarian or Polish, which was a shame. My family was working class, and did not think that any of these languages could be important for us in the United States. And since the Communists took over this part of Eastern-Europe, I believe the thinking was that nobody’s going to go there, so why would the children need to know these languages? 

– Could you speak about the source of your vocation as a priest?

– I can’t remember ever wanting to do anything else. Why or how God planted this idea in me, I don’t really know. But even at four or five years old, I thought the church building was beautiful and mysterious. Different and strange. It had statues, incense and interesting-looking men in strange clothes doing things and singing. So the mystery somehow attracted me.

– Did you feel a specific call to be a Franciscan priest?

– Yes and no; I wanted be a priest first and foremost. Then I became attracted to the Franciscan lifestyle of community and simplicity. And I thought, I would like to see the world. And the Franciscans were worldwide.  Such were the thoughts of a very callow young man.

– How long did you serve as a Catholic priest?

– I was ordained in 1974, and I left in 1980. So about five and a half, six years.

– If it is not too personal, can I ask you about the reasons?

– There were two sets of reasons. The first was more personal. I had gone to the Franciscans at age 14, and as a young adult, I began to think more and more. I don’t know anything about life the way people live it. I never had a girlfriend, never went to a dance. So I thought, well, I should take some time off. The other reasons were perhaps more theological. I found myself more and more troubled by some of the positions of the Roman Catholic Church.

– Can you mention examples?

– My parents were divorced, and I thought the church was not really responding to that situation adequately. There were some other questions, many of them similar to the issues facing the church today and having to do with intimacy issues. And I thought I needed some distance from that world to sort things out. 

– “Once a Catholic, always a Catholic”, as the saying goes. Or, in your case, not really?

– It is true because the viewpoint of the Anglican communion is that we are indeed Catholic. The Roman Catholics might disagree, but the Anglicans are aware that we are part of an ancient tradition. The Church of England has existed since the 200s, it went through the reformation in the 16th century, but it was Catholic before and it remained Catholic after.

– How did you find your way to Anglicanism?

– It’s truly a story of God’s grace. After I left the Catholic priesthood, I got a job as a hospital clinic manager, and had my own social life and friends. I lived in Minneapolis, and one day went to a reception, where I met a guy who turned out to be the new local Episcopal priest. We were about the same age, and discovered that had been ordained in the same city on the same day but in different Churches. I began attending his church, appreciated its openness, liked his sermons. I said, well, this is good, even though I didn’t agree with everything, but that would be an impossible wish. So I joined the community, first as a lay person. Then one day he said to me: you’re a priest, and you’re an Anglican. So you should be an Anglican priest. It’s good logic, I thought. Encouraged by him, I went and talked to the local bishop, applied, and became an Anglican priest in 1987.

– Was re-ordination necessary?

– No. Anglicans recognize Roman Catholic priests as priests for eternity. A ceremony was held to affirm my ministry within the Anglican Church.

– When I first came to your service, I was astonished at how similar the Anglican and Catholic liturgies are. What are the main differences between the two churches that really make a difference?

– I’ll tell you first the obvious ones. I never got married, but if I in my old age decided I wanted to, as an Anglican priest I could. God help that poor woman… And women are allowed to become deacons, priests and bishops in most of the Anglican world. I like that. The other aspect I admire in Anglicanism is the sensitivity. According to the joke, if you go to an Anglican priest, looking for advice and ask, “Father, what should I do?”, the priest will say, “That’s a very good question. What do you think you should do?” I think this is a very good approach. I can guide the person, but it should be his or her answer. And I’m not saying that the Roman Catholic priests don’t do that. This is just a hallmark of the way Anglicans think. 

– What about major issues, like the inclusion of LGBTQ individuals?

– This is more or less no longer a question in the U.S. Episcopal Church. But in some Anglican churches in Africa, for instance, it is a problem. In the Church of England, many people are not bothered by this issue, others are troubled by it. I like the open-minded approach and the idea that we should trust the Holy Spirit. If we pray long and hard enough, the Spirit will lead us to the answer. That’s another hallmark of Anglicanism, I think. No matter what our beliefs are, we say we should pray together.

– In this sense, the Anglican church is like a huge umbrella, and thus accommodates diverse traditions. Not to mention that you have the Catholic leaning High Church and the more protestant Low Church.

– Exactly. In my opinion, Queen Elizabeth I, after Henry VIII, said in effect: people are killing each other over religion. Jesus cannot be happy. So she said, “Here are the basics. You just believe these, and you’re okay. You’re not going to lose your head, we’ve had enough bloodshed.” This at least is my interpretation of history. What is yet another hallmark in Anglicanism is the realization that lay people should have a say in how the church is run. From bottom to top.

– How does it work at Saint Margaret’s?

– I consult the church council on virtually all major issues. Happily, we see eye-to-eye on most issues. In the final analysis, clergy are responsible for the spiritual welfare and prayer life of the community; the church council, for, say, financial and material matters. I like that balance. By the way, the King of England is the lay head of the Church of England in roughly the same way Tamás Sulyok is the president of Hungary. He makes virtually no decisions, and neither does King Charles. The archbishop of Canterbury has a lot of authority in his own diocese, but in terms of the whole church of England, it is the general synod, including bishops and lay representatives, that make the major decisions. I am a great admirer – and most Anglicans are also – of Pope Francis. I sometimes joke with my Roman Catholic priest friends, saying, I think he is perhaps “a secret Anglican” in the way he sometimes approaches things. Let’s take just synodality: he wants Roman Catholic church to approach matters similarly to the way Anglicans have long been doing things. For us, the baptismal covenant itself is very important. The church is not the property of the clergy. It is the property of the people and clergy together. And the clergy are the servants of the people.

– You celebrated your 50th priestly anniversary a few weeks ago. On the screen, it was very impressive to see the name of some twenty places you have been as a priest. And now you’ve been here for 14 years. Could you share some key achievements or highlights of your service in Hungary?

– Well, I have very much enjoyed it. I’ve always loved Hungary. I made my first visit to the country during the Communist period in 1971. Then after 1990 I came back every two or three years as a tourist. When my predecessor, The Revd Canon Denis Moss retired and the job became available, I thought it could be a good place to serve, so I applied and got the position from the bishop, the people of course agreeing. By the way, Canon Denis, ninety-two years old, now lives in Zalaszántó in retirement, although he plans to return to his native New Zealand soon. The congregation was very small when I arrived, but we have grown, with current Sunday attendance about 50-55 congregants. It is an international community, we have lots of people from various parts of the world: Brits, Americans, Canadians, and nowadays more and more from Africa and South Asia. Retired people, businesspeople, students. 

– And what challenges does St. Margaret’s face?

– The opportunities bring their own challenges. People in a congregation like this generally often come and go, depending on their job and work commitments. A large number of the people who were members when I came are not here anymore. The ones that stay are the ones who have a connection to Hungary, such as marriage or family background. The other thing that’s unique is that the most active members of our congregation are men. An interesting development.

– The interview will come out on the Week of Prayer for Christian Unity. Do you have a specific feeling about this initiative?

– Yes, I do. The idea for this week originated 100 years ago with a U.S. Episcopal priest named Paul Wattson, who was involved in the Oxford movement. An advocate of the High Church tradition and unity with the Catholic Church, he believed all denominations should strive for closer cooperation. Inspired by the proximity of the festival days of St. Peter and St. Paul in January, he proposed a week of prayer for unity. Roman Catholics often associate with St. Peter, while many Reformation churches identify with St. Paul, making this period symbolic. The initiative started small in the U.S. but quickly spread worldwide. Interestingly, Wattson later became a Roman Catholic priest.

– You’re involved in the ecumenical movement in Hungary. What are your experiences?

– I’m very happy with the good relations we have with the other churches. We are members and strong supporters of the Council of Hungarian Churches. The general secretary of the council, The Revd Dr Vilmos Fischl graciously invited me to be a member in their executive committee, and it is my privilege to serve, even though I do not speak Hungarian particularly well. I think Dr Fischl values the Anglican community. We maintain good relations with all the Churches of Hungary and are perhaps particularly close to the Lutherans and hold our Sunday services in one of their chapels in Budapest, in Szentkirályi street. And in theology they’re probably the closest of the churches in Hungary to us. I also know some of the reformed pastors and bishops, Catholic bishop László Kiss-Rigó is a good friend of our community, I have met cardinal Péter Erdő on a number of occasions, and he is also very cordial to us. Lutheran bishop Tamás Fabiny has been very kind and helpful to us, offering this chapel, for one thing, and his successor as the bishop chairman of the Hungarian Lutheran church, János Szemerei is very friendly, too.

– The last one is a “what if” question. Over the past 50 years, both churches have changed a lot. If you were the same age now when you left the Catholic Church, would you make the same decision?

– Difficult, perhaps impossible to say. I am very happy being an Anglican. After all, the Holy Spirit led me here.

 

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Why is the Anglican Church called Episcopalian in the United States?

After the American Revolution, Church of England congregations in the newly independent States reorganized themselves as a new church—free from the King of England and from oversight by English bishops. The new church took the name “Episcopal” to emphasize the historic ministry of bishops, priests and deacons. In addition, the first American bishops were consecrated by bishops of the Episcopal Church of Scotland. According to legend, this also led to the American Anglicans calling themselves Episcopalians. You see: Anglican means English in Latin; and at the time of the American Revolution in 1776, the Americans viewed the English with suspicion; so, the American Anglicans thought it might be prudent to instead use the word Episcopal.